structured or freeform?... i'd say both

but not always seeing them as opposing equal 'forces' , but working together and melding into one another

and i use tunes, seldom scales or patterned exercises

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Originally posted by martyjoe

I spent a few years (15) away from music and worked as a skydiving instructor. In skydiving it can’t be stressed enough that first learning is crucial. No matter how ingrained subsequent learning is when a person is under sudden extreme stress they are more likely to revert back to what they learnt first even if they know it to be incorrect. This also makes a lot of sense for learning music.

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Absolutely.  There are people I've known since they started playing music 20-40 years ago (me included) who regress 18-38 years under performance pressure.  Even though they've grown to be good musicians (me not included), they fall back on the style, licks, and poor technique learned early in their musical journey when in front of a large audience, a musician they admire, etc.  

I wonder if a lot of that regression, as you put it, isn’t a product of a lack of concentration in the moment - likely caused by the distraction of an audience, less familiar environment, etc.

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Originally posted by Johnbow

I wonder if a lot of that regression, as you put it, isn’t a product of a lack of concentration in the moment - likely caused by the distraction of an audience, less familiar environment, etc.

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All of the a above. Sensory overload is a big one. 

Thanks to the use of the static line to deploy my chute upon my first and only parachute jump, I do not currently occupy the bottom of a shallow crater somewhere in north central Iowa. I hope I didn't miss anything else important. I surely wasn't going to miss the ground. The view was great once I pulled my act together.

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Originally posted by boxbow

Thanks to the use of the static line to deploy my chute upon my first and only parachute jump, I do not currently occupy the bottom of a shallow crater somewhere in north central Iowa. I hope I didn't miss anything else important. I surely wasn't going to miss the ground. The view was great once I pulled my act together.

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That’s a common recollection for many people. Your instructor must have been confident in your ability to perform on the day otherwise you wouldn't have got to jump. The good old static line did improve the the fatality rate in the sport. There is no static line when you go out on stage for the first time and a lot more first time performers think they are going to die. 

Well...at the adult classical guitar recital...
a lot of the adults were first-time performers and the first guy that went out there (no sheet music allowed) he started his piece, got 1/3 in and just blanked. I had heard him play it through flawlessly and beautifully many times, so I was bummed for him. Then the person after him blanked midway through, gave up and walked off the stage. Then the next person...it was like a Virus. Until l finally it was my dreaded turn and I was waiting to blank. But I made it! My secret? It wasn't my first rodeo! Had been through the nerves, adrenaline, etc with violin already and knew how to just focus on the music and block out the other stuff. I had the dubious distinction of being the only player to actually finish my piece...
Well, at the next recital, everybody was allowed to have sheet music! :-D

The funny thing was our audience (mostly family and friends) who were sitting on the edge of their seats and perfectly silent and still. They were afraid to move or make any noise for fear of derailing the players...you could have heard a pin drop, and that was a big group of people! :-D

It's fiddle or guitar or whatever. Nobody's about to die.

My fingerpickin guitar heroes where Bert Jansch and John Renbourn Try gettin up on stage and playin some of that stuff after a well loved local skiffle band lol.

i soon learned it didn't really matter. Especially after i found Mississippi John Hurt. After that, fiddle was a breeze...Until i found it wasn't!

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Originally posted by NCnotes

Well...at the adult classical guitar recital...
a lot of the adults were first-time performers and the first guy that went out there (no sheet music allowed) he started his piece, got 1/3 in and just blanked. I had heard him play it through flawlessly and beautifully many times, so I was bummed for him. Then the person after him blanked midway through, gave up and walked off the stage. Then the next person...it was like a Virus. Until l finally it was my dreaded turn and I was waiting to blank. But I made it! My secret? It wasn't my first rodeo! Had been through the nerves, adrenaline, etc with violin already and knew how to just focus on the music and block out the other stuff. I had the dubious distinction of being the only player to actually finish my piece...
Well, at the next recital, everybody was allowed to have sheet music! :-D

The funny thing was our audience (mostly family and friends) who were sitting on the edge of their seats and perfectly silent and still. They were afraid to move or make any noise for fear of derailing the players...you could have heard a pin drop, and that was a big group of people! :-D

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Reading your post brought me back to the recitals I've done. Certainly not playing the violin and not the guitar either, but lots of piano recitals. Some good, others not good - always so exposed. Really, a totally different feeling than playing in a group setting which I've also done plenty, though then as a wanna-be rockstar. Alas, now it's just me and my music room, which for the moment is just fine. 

I got to see Mississippi John Hurt at the Newport Folk festival, along with Son House and Skip James. John Hurt was just as relaxed and personable on stage as you might expect from his recordings (which I spent many hours trying to copy). Much like Doc Watson, another one of my great heroes.

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Originally posted by pete_fiddle

It's fiddle or guitar or whatever. Nobody's about to die.

My fingerpickin guitar heroes where Bert Jansch and John Renbourn Try gettin up on stage and playin some of that stuff after a well loved local skiffle band lol.

i soon learned it didn't really matter. Especially after i found Mississippi John Hurt. After that, fiddle was a Good nightbreeze...Until i found it wasn't!

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I mean, I guess you could die. Your heart could explode, couldn't it? :)

It’s amazing how younger people breeze through it. We’re having the Westmeath County Fleadh this weekend. This basically is the qualifying round for the All Ireland music competition. There will be hundreds of children competing in various categories and age groups showing only the slightest sign of nervousness if at all, and then in the senior age a bunch of nervous wrecks, some like me struggling to get through each piece. I’ve got the shakes already.

i reckon i played better fiddle when i had no idea of what i was doing at all, and cared less. All this structure and stuff is really for pro violinists. Fiddle is a different animal.

Edit:  just thought....i think that consistency is one of the last things that a fiddler would be thinking about imo. They just play?

I suppose you might ask what is meant by consistency—whether it’s keeping up a regular schedule of practicing or measurable improvement.

If your goal is to just play more often, then deliberately scheduling it and mapping out practice sessions is a way to hold yourself to something and set trackable objectives.

If it’s more about improvement, structure is helpful in reaching these goals the quickest. However, progress is not always linear, and learning is a complex journey. The teaching methods themselves are more linear, but the brain doesn’t always process things at a constant speed. A certain technique may simply take a long time to sink in. Some progress is not discernible to you until you reach the target. For this reason I don’t recommend getting too bogged down in metrics.

Go, Marty! (if you can leap out of an airplane, fiddling has got to be easy!)

Yea Mississippi John Hurt is amazing…music straight from the soul.

you just improve hopefully, by playing more, and correcting yourself as you go along. By listening to players you admire.

Edit: One thing i would practice, is standard basic music theory. Then you can tell if and when a player is diverging from it, and gives you a solid ground to study them from.

For me consistency is about playing at the same level. As we’re alluding to before inconsistency is being a lounge room legend one minute and then chocking when there’s a few people listening or even when nobody is listening the next. Once consistency is achieved confidence will follow.

Really enjoyed reading this discussion. It’s always inspiring to see how different fiddle players approach learning, technique, and musical expression while still sharing the same passion for traditional music and community.

I’m upping my practice/training now. I didn’t get placed in the first round of the fiddle competition so that’s the end of fiddle for a while. I got a 3rd in tenor banjo which isn’t good enough to get through either. The good thing is I got 1st in mouth organ and I also got through to the next round in the miscellaneous category with the tenor Viola. So I actually am fiddling:-) each day I practice intensely for about two hours then sleep it off, rest for an hour or two and then go again. I’ve stopped working on making instruments for the time being. So I’m working in a similar fashion to how I trained as an athlete when I was in my teens, more time focused on rest and recovery than time on the track. It’s working well my playing is definitely going up a notch! I’ve changed the jig from The lilting fisherman to The Sunny Hills of Beara (Gm) and the reel from The yellow tinker to Trim the velvet. The next round is the Leinster fleadh on the 28th of June. 1st and 2nd through to the final in August.

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Originally posted by Brian Wood

Your conversion to drinking water regularly is good. I likewise stay hydrated, but with beer. You can actually live on beer because it has some nutrients and is more hydrating than it is dehydrating (it's both). Winos, on the other hand, will die without water, or beer.

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That whole "Beer is good food" thing was a bit of a train wreck for me, personally.  You seem pretty well suited, though.  Good luck.  I've had to learn to fill my coffee mug with water and drink it before refilling with coffee.  Adaptability  to your changing needs as a fiddler might be the thing here.  As it happens, I've switched to half decaf.