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Jan 9, 2026 - 4:20:48 AM

Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

I decided to create a topic for this. I have the chance to test out a refurbished 4/4 (!) pernambuco bow of only 52.4 gram.
The weight of this bow intrigues me. IF I permit myself a new wooden bow (Ziva broke my first one) I have to keep into account my budget so I chose for refurbished plus I'd rather want something completely different than what I work with now.
I never handled a bow that nearly was 53 gram.
My expectations are high, I really expect something different! Something that will be surprising.
If the bow is not what I was hoping for I will send it back.

I read up on balance and light bows and history of bows regarding weight , I assume this one is just a rather old bow.

Anyone here who can tell me more on this strange weight? It is NOT a baroque bow.

Edited by - Quincy on 01/09/2026 04:21:44

Jan 9, 2026 - 5:33:34 AM
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DougD

USA

12960 posts since 12/2/2007

Do you know anything else about this bow? Maker, age, country of origin? Is it silver mounted, or nickel silver? And what does "refurbished" mean exactly, in this case? If its very much money, I think I'd be asking these sorts of questions.

Jan 9, 2026 - 6:34:21 AM

Strabo

USA

161 posts since 8/30/2021

Also, pay attention to tone. I have used bows that have wonderful weight and balance, but unacceptable tone. Get someone else to play with that bow so you can hear the result at a little distance.

Jan 9, 2026 - 7:58:51 AM
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2418 posts since 3/1/2020

52.4 is extremely light, even for an older bow, enough that it makes me suspicious that either the stick is way too soft or something had been done to it that caused it to lose so much weight (replacement frog with lighter wood, significantly different winding, etc.). For a baroque bow or an Arcus hollow carbon fiber (or one of the copies), this weight would not be surprising, but baroque bows are shorter and have less metal on them and carbon fiber is much stiffer. Older bows are often in the 57-59 range, and they’re considered very light. It sounds a little silly, but I might suggest making sure it’s a full size bow. Also, are you certain it’s pernambuco and not brazilwood or something else lighter?

You’ll have to play it to see what you think about its performance. I’d expect a bow that light to be very whippy and likely to render an anemic tone. If the refurbishment took a lot of weight out at the frog end (if so, I’d seriously question the thought process behind the refurbishment), it would likely be way out of balance and tip heavy.

I agree that it would be good to have someone else listen as you play, preferably an experienced player. Especially as a beginning player, it's not always easy to appreciate the more subtle differences in equipment. 

Edited by - The Violin Beautiful on 01/09/2026 08:00:50

Jan 9, 2026 - 8:00:18 PM

gapbob

USA

941 posts since 4/20/2008

The are lots of used bows, if it is costly, sampling others that are available would be wise, as we improve, our expectations of a bow can change and you might find this bow to no longer satisfy. I have a couple lighter bows, one is pretty stiff the other not as much, they have different characteristics in tone, but with less power than my 62-ish gram bows.

i also worry about the "refurbished" nature of this bow.

Edited by - gapbob on 01/09/2026 20:01:07

Jan 10, 2026 - 5:46:28 AM
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Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

WOW.

The stick has arrived. I find it highly remarkable, exceptionally forgiving, and all the issues I couldn't seem to overcome have been resolved. The precision of the bow surprises me enormously, especially the feeling that my fingers sometimes get in the way has completely disappeared, and the effects in terms of tone strength and variation are perfect. I had expected to get less sound out of it, but the opposite is true. I asked the luthier who is selling it for more background information.

Jan 10, 2026 - 5:48:38 AM
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Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

Maybe it is just a first impression, but I like what I can do with it!

Jan 10, 2026 - 7:24:46 AM

Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

Got my answers on the origin: "'I strongly suspect that this stick is of German origin, dating from the early 20th century. Unfortunately, I no longer remember how I acquired it, as the documentation on this is no longer easy to find. I suspect that it belonged to an instrument from a private trade-in or estate purchase and that it then spent many years in a box of bows labeled “to be revised.” After I took partial retirement, I had a little more time, so I refurbished a number of bows from this stock. A special feature is the frog, with both the frog plate and the heel made of mother-of-pearl: the latter is usually made of silver or nickel silver. Its low weight is also striking. The bow is most likely made of pernambuco wood. The fact that this bow is a few millimeters smaller than your other bows is probably not that unusual."

Jan 10, 2026 - 7:39:10 AM

DougD

USA

12960 posts since 12/2/2007

Can you post a photo, especially of the frog? I'm glad you're liking it - there's a lot more to the performance of a bow than just the weight, and everyone has their own needs and taste.

Jan 10, 2026 - 8:16:24 AM
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martyjoe

Ireland

262 posts since 7/11/2024

Keep this one away from Ziva

Jan 10, 2026 - 8:50:58 AM
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Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

For my way of doing I can get incredibly expressive with soft louder loudest. It is very easy to pull out good sound on slow tunes . For fast playing I need to adapt my usual angle. It has a way it can play very fast but if you overdo it's not that forgiving anymore. But it can handle plenty of could have gone the wrong direction issues . This is the coolest bow I own. It's hard to take a good close up , it's dark now. I'll see what I can do tomorrow when it's day light. I tried to upload the bad quality pics I took, but he forum did not seem to have accepted my pics.

I can create a whole list of things that I like about this bow. It's easier to handle, a lot and a lot of things that always bothered me disappeared! I'll add an mp3. I love this bow. I'll keep it far from Ziva!


Edited by - Quincy on 01/10/2026 08:57:50

Jan 10, 2026 - 10:30:38 AM

2418 posts since 3/1/2020

If the bow is shorter, that might make some sense. Having pearl on the back of the frog isn’t really that unique, though, as bows like that are seen from multiple regions regularly. If the luthier says it’s “likely pernambuco,” that makes me wonder more if it’s not. That aspect doesn’t discount it as a tool if it suits you playing, but it does directly affect its value.

If you’re happy with the way the bow plays and you’re not concerned with resale in the future, and if the condition is good, then it will hopefully serve you well.

Jan 11, 2026 - 2:12:31 AM

Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

I was able to take pictures. Above in the picture with three bows is my temu bow, in the middle my codabow Joule and below is the new one. It is round and feels noticeably smaller, as you can see it is also shorter (not very clear maybe in this picture but all bows have similar tension and are put at the same line of the vinyl floor). I am playing faster tunes with it now, it feels so comfortable and flexible. This bow is something completely different as I wished for. Reselling is never my plan. My old sensei always explained to me about having no expectations and not to get attached to material things. But my fiddle stuff serves higher goals so yes kind of attached to it hehe.




 

Edited by - Quincy on 01/11/2026 02:18:09

Jan 11, 2026 - 4:55:14 AM
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GeorgeH

USA

58 posts since 2/23/2018

Quincy , It is wonderful that this bow is working out for you.

As Rich said, 52.4g is extremely light, but weight does not tell the whole story. The balance point and camber are also extremely important as to individual bow feel and performance. I have two bows that I like to use to demonstrate this. One is a good French bow and one is a fine German bow and they both weigh exactly 60g. However, the French bow feels significantly lighter than the German bow. In fact, it feels lighter than all my other German and French bows. (My bows all weigh between 58-62g.)

The French bow is a very good sounding bow and performs the bow gymnastics that classical players require, but I personally like the bows that feel a bit heavier in my hand. It gives me a more even feel in my hand through the entire draw of the bow.

Some players prefer a balance point closer to the frog because they feel it makes the bow easier to control when playing close to the frog or because it feels more like a baroque bow. Maybe they would keep a bow like this French one for particular pieces. I have also been told that some orchestral players keep lighter bows for long rehearsals because it reduces right hand fatigue.

Trying different bows is fun. There is no standard for what makes a bow great. Bows by the great master makers will feel and sound different even within their own production.

Edited by - GeorgeH on 01/11/2026 04:57:38

Jan 11, 2026 - 8:12:49 AM

Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

@GeorgeH : now that I have tried this lighter bow all the others feel like too heavy for me. They feel now like the heavy adult trumpet I carried as a young kid.: as a bad fit.

I love the sound this old bow creates on this old fiddle. It can sound sweet and a bit melodramatic and rather classic like in the example I already posted, but it can give also an overall sound effect like in this bow test fragment.
I find it surprising, at least. I don't think I sounded like this before.
I must have some good luck angel on my shoulder when it comes to choosing fiddle related stuff. Or I am just so obsessed by the instrument that I find charm in everything that is playable, who knows :-p I would not even care if that was nothing but the plain truth!


Jan 11, 2026 - 10:41:04 AM
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4135 posts since 10/22/2007

The bow can either make playing music feel like hard work, or a joy!
I'm glad you found your joy!

Jan 11, 2026 - 11:04:13 AM
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DougD

USA

12960 posts since 12/2/2007

Don't forget that you had some help from Ziva! I'm starting to think she may have noticed your old bow was holding you back and decided to give you a little nudge towards trying something new, in the only way she could. Maybe give her a pat on the head, or an extra biscuit.

Jan 11, 2026 - 2:26:52 PM
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Quincy

Belgium

1498 posts since 1/16/2021

Steve , thanks :--) Doug, Ziva is spoiled rotten already , that is the most burgundian dog I ever owned, but I agree she deserves something extra hehe.

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