ViolinLessonVideos - Posted - 07/13/2012:  21:02:38

There is an incredible amount of joy that comes to any violinist/fiddler from playing a tune or piece well. Having it sing forth on your instrument, and bring joy even to others who might be listening. How can you beat that? And yet, there is still something that may be even better than that grand experience.

One word for it is “improvising.” Improvising is either adding a melodic expression/idea of your own invention into your perfected melody, or totally replacing your song with your own invention.If you have never tried this, I recommend it strongly. It is an experience you don’t want to miss out on, and I am confident that you won’t be disappointed for at least giving yourself a chance to take a swing at it!

I call improvising a need, because I believe that every violin player has to experience doing it in one form or another, in order to be really fulfilled. When you start improvising, you are really expressing yourself through your music more than you possibly could through performing someone else’s composition as it was written. I think that we should all learn to play in the same way that we creatively speak every moment that we converse. And the kind of playing that I’m suggesting might become just as natural (with a lot of practice, of course)!

What often keeps one from creative playing is fear. Fear of putting the wrong notes in the wrong places. This fear gradually goes away though as you continue, because you come to realize that you are going to put the wrong notes in the wrong places, but that’s all right! Because you are experimenting, just like a good inventor. Thomas Edison, in referring to his experience inventing the light bulb said, “I have not failed. I’ve just found 10000 ways that won’t work.” So please don’t look at messing up as failing, but rather as an opportunity to learn what not to play. Your mistakes just gain you more wisdom and valuable experience on your instrument.

In teaching the violin, I have often reminded my students that they should be mature perfectionists. A mature perfectionist is someone who strives for perfection, but allows himself  to mess up without quitting or being discouraged, learning from his mistakes.

It’s a pity to see so many players who know their instruments so well through years of experience with even complex pieces, not use their knowledge and experience to be creative, and to even learn more by ear, which deserves another whole article.

The very first step on the road to improvisation on your violin is to obtain recordings of someone who is good at decorating the melody with nice, mature creative ideas, ideas that are pleasing to the ear and sound doable (or maybe kind of doable). The next step is to imitate what they are doing. many giants in the fiddling realm began as good imitators. Imitators of their heroes. Now they are someone else’s hero. To be a hero is not our goal (hopefully–although that does happen on rare occasions), but just to broaden our horizons on our instruments, and enjoy the experience. Maybe someone else will enjoy listening along the way, too.

Playing jazz also deserves an article all its own, and probably many more. But I hope that at least I have sparked a little interest for those  who may not have spent enough time thinking about our topic. Or, maybe I have provided the last encouragement needed to get someone to step out and do the unthinkable. -Brendan Booher

Edited by - ViolinLessonVideos on 07/13/2012 21:06:27

fiddlechops - Posted - 07/14/2012:  16:58:17

There are only 12 notes in the key, each note belongs to a scale or an arppegio or it could be a chromatic passing note, or it could be called a chord extention. So there can never be a 'wrong note' because there are'nt any.
There is no need to invent melodies and decorate them. The notes can meander without repeating any melodic line.
Jazz is not the only genre within to improvise, and I don't care if no-one enjoys listening, I play it for me......

Diane in Chicago - Posted - 07/14/2012:  18:13:00

Make a backup track here, people, and have at it!    It will even transpose for you!

jamstudio.com/Studio/index.htm

Peghead - Posted - 07/17/2012:  10:05:14

Yes, lets all loose the fear of the next note.

richdissmore - Posted - 07/17/2012:  10:59:39

the grate jazz guitar player Joe Pass said there is no such thing as a wrong note only miss placed

haggis - Posted - 07/17/2012:  12:23:43

My pal likes to say," If you hit a dud note,hit it again so folk will think you meant it!"

martynspeck - Posted - 07/17/2012:  13:53:32

quote:

---

Originally posted by Diane in Chicago

Make a backup track here, people, and have at it!    It will even transpose for you!

 

jamstudio.com/Studio/index.htm

---

OK. That's pretty cool.

alaskafiddler - Posted - 07/17/2012:  23:05:09

quote:

---

Originally posted by Henry George

There are only 12 notes in the key, each note belongs to a scale or an arppegio or it could be a chromatic passing note, or it could be called a chord extention. So there can never be a 'wrong note' because there are'nt any.

There is no need to invent melodies and decorate them. The notes can meander without repeating any melodic line.

Jazz is not the only genre within to improvise, and I don't care if no-one enjoys listening, I play it for me......

---

I guess that' one way of looking at it. By that logic you expand on it, there's no such thing as wrong timed note, theoretically anyplace you play a note you can justify; and you don't have limit yourself to 12 notes, any frequency comes into play, so there is never "poor intonation".

For myself I like context - melodic, rhythmic and harmonic, which give meaning to each note; and so in the music I like there are indeed there are "wrong notes" -

And for myself; no matter how many times you repeat it, do it again, if it lacks any contextual meaning it comes across to me as a "wrong note" - even if I believe you meant it - I just believe you don't a great concept of what makes good music.

But if you get pleasure out of random notes (no contextual meaning) - and care that no one else enjoys it, at least you're having fun. Put a frame around it and call it art.

Edited by - alaskafiddler on 07/17/2012 23:07:29

haggis - Posted - 07/18/2012:  06:41:21

"If you hit a dud note" is not to say " Hit a dud note." Unfortunately I hit many.

Diane in Chicago - Posted - 07/18/2012:  08:37:43

quote:

---

Originally posted by martynspeck

quote:

---

Originally posted by Diane in Chicago

Make a backup track here, people, and have at it!    It will even transpose for you!

 

jamstudio.com/Studio/index.htm

---

OK. That's pretty cool.

---

If you make a track with the suggested chords for the chosen key that is pretty complex and uses lots of changes and choices, you can noodle along on you basic pentatonic notes and sound like a genius -- except to others who already know this trick, but they will still respect your musical moxie.

If you make a track with just the basic I IV V chords, you can noodle on the pentatonic notes of each of those chords as they come along.  That one takes more grey matter, but gets to be second nature as you do it more and more.  Leave the chords playing for more than one measure to start, and go slow. 

And don't fear pauses.  It is okay to take a breath in the middle there.

boxbow - Posted - 07/18/2012:  10:03:14

It's easy to play a lot of notes and sound wrong.

It's hard to play only a few notes and sound right.

Hardest of all is to play anything at all and make the other guy sound good.

bj - Posted - 07/20/2012:  12:22:57

When I was first playing in front of people Janey kept reminding me that the folks listening didn't know the tunes so they didn't know if or when I made a mistake! Though we do try to put our best foot forward when performing, the occasional oops is inevitable (even for the most seasoned performers!) It's how you deal with that oops and play past it that makes the difference. If you stop, then folks know you screwed up! So KEEP PLAYING!

ironworker - Posted - 07/20/2012:  14:15:40

" If you stop, then folks know you screwed up! So KEEP PLAYING! "

plus, if you stop, the dancers get confused, then pissed.

alaskafiddler - Posted - 07/20/2012:  15:00:26

quote:

---

Originally posted by bj

When I was first playing in front of people Janey kept reminding me that the folks listening didn't know the tunes so they didn't know if or when I made a mistake! Though we do try to put our best foot forward when performing, the occasional oops is inevitable (even for the most seasoned performers!) It's how you deal with that oops and play past it that makes the difference. If you stop, then folks know you screwed up! So KEEP PLAYING!

---

 To a point, yes folks don't have any idea of what the "real" melody is; and certainly if you are playing that still work, they wouldn't notice. However it is possible to hit some real clinkers, that stand out as incredibly obvious to listeners; listeners are much more knowledgeable about what sounds good (or not) then they are given credit for. For example playing an A tune and hitting a strongly accented Bb, in a harmonically significant spot, it will probably sound wrong.

Certainly though you can minimize the effect of clinkers, sour notes; It's what you do after. Certainly keep going, move on is part of it, especially if the note was more rhythmic, not a strong point; if that clinkers causes you to stop, pause, get lost it becomes more apparent. Another technique is to turn the clinker into something that sounds right. One is that you are usually only a half step away (up or down) to something that sounds good. Maybe a whole step. Hit a sour note, and immediately play a good note, and it can sound just fine, as if it were an intended effect.

fiddlechops - Posted - 07/21/2012:  02:39:47

Keep playing, absolutely. We used to have a chuckle...interesting variation that.

Make the other guy sound good. No wonder I gigged with the same guy for over 20 years!
And we never rehearsed, that's why I practised to improvise and I never accompanied a song the same way twice!

And I was never accused of playing a 'wrong note' or that my playing 'lacked any contextual meaning'.

I suppose that can only happen on the internet?

fdllicks - Posted - 07/26/2012:  07:15:45

what a great post. I heard once, people think that an advanced player plays perfectly. Not true. The skill an advanced player has is to recover from mistakes. Recovering from mistakes without losing the timing is a priceless skill, and what seperates intermediates from advanced players more than playing 'perfectly'.

Mandobart - Posted - 09/11/2012:  12:50:34

Maybe not immediately transferable to fiddles, but as the great Jethro Burns used to say, "You're always on the right note or just one fret [half-step] away!"

The space between the notes is equally important to me as the notes.  An easy trap for an accomplished player just beginning to improvise in a group is the "constant stream of non-stop notes", or as another listener once put it "what's will all the deedle-dee-dee stuff?"

p1cklef1sh - Posted - 09/11/2012:  18:13:49

yea, Ive still got a long row to hoe with this one........

fiddlenbanjo - Posted - 11/24/2012:  22:33:49

This thread is a good argument for not playing a tune too straight to begin with, for the longer you play it exactly the way people already have it in their head, the more that first missed note is going to stick out. If you give even the most recognizable tune some of your own fiddle flavor in the first few bars it creates a little leeway for you later. The listener knows right off the bat you aren't trying to play it exactly "according to Hoyle."

IdleHands - Posted - 11/30/2012:  07:42:31

quote:

---

Originally posted by fiddlenbanjo

This thread is a good argument for not playing a tune too straight to begin with, for the longer you play it exactly the way people already have it in their head, the more that first missed note is going to stick out. If you give even the most recognizable tune some of your own fiddle flavor in the first few bars it creates a little leeway for you later. The listener knows right off the bat you aren't trying to play it exactly "according to Hoyle."

---

The flip side of the coin is that if we start filling in space with with improvised riffs, we begin to actually lose the melody, which is actually pretty specific.  Not that what we improvise will sound bad per se, but these tunes are beautiful and unique.

rustycase - Posted - 11/30/2012:  08:48:26

...to learn balance in composition...

Gosh I've got a long way to go!

rustycase - Posted - 11/30/2012:  21:46:00

quote:

---

Originally posted by richdissmore

the grate jazz guitar player Joe Pass said there is no such thing as a wrong note only miss placed

---

ok Rich, I got a specific question about that.

I am just now learning.  I know nothing.

I have seen mention of notes, by number.   not by finger number on a string.

and I'll try to relay my thoughts intelligently, so you might understand!!!

If a player were to mis-key a note, while playing the desired specific tune,  could the player, at that time, insert a progression of notes, which sum would total what should end up corresponding with the end result of the original tune?

..that might be to say, why do embellishments work, and why. or how they work?

...or a jazzy/bluesie influence imposed upon a tune?

I shall apologize...   I do not yet know how to speak music.

Yet I have questions!  lol

...Joe Pass may say, mis-placed...  I am thinking it may be corrected with a progression, within time.

I enjoy a blues presentation, perhaps with slides, slurs, and flats, yet  have difficulty appreciating jazz as being assyncopated, and random, which I am not able to relate to...  one friend attempted to explain jazz to me, as keying on the guitar, and not the drum beat, but that didn't work, for me...

Obviously, I am new to theory, yet hope to understand.

If anyone has thoughts, I would very much appreciate them!

tnx

rc

fiddlenbanjo - Posted - 12/01/2012:  06:01:15

quote:

---

Originally posted by IdleHands

quote:

---

Originally posted by fiddlenbanjo

This thread is a good argument for not playing a tune too straight to begin with, for the longer you play it exactly the way people already have it in their head, the more that first missed note is going to stick out. If you give even the most recognizable tune some of your own fiddle flavor in the first few bars it creates a little leeway for you later. The listener knows right off the bat you aren't trying to play it exactly "according to Hoyle."

---

The flip side of the coin is that if we start filling in space with with improvised riffs, we begin to actually lose the melody, which is actually pretty specific.  Not that what we improvise will sound bad per se, but these tunes are beautiful and unique.

---

There are so many things you can do to show that you are playing the tune and not vice versa, and without significantly changing the melody at all.

slide into a note

come into a note chromatically from below....from above

add a drone or double stop

throw in a triplet if it feels right

stay too long on a note, then skip the next note or two and catch up

add a few pick up notes at the beginning or between lines

find a place to accent and/or change volume

make it really dramatic at some point



Always make it fiddly.

 

Edited by - fiddlenbanjo on 12/01/2012 06:02:56

erburro - Posted - 12/11/2012:  22:41:44

I use Band in a Box a lot so I am basicly playing over a chord chart. I even use it to gig with when there is only me and a bass player. I also play a solo gig using band in a box and my fiddle. To warm up I set a style and just play over one chord. It is great practice .

tokencruiser - Posted - 12/21/2012:  23:15:56

Yup, whenever something isn't right just slide up or down. Sounds even better on the fretless variety of instruments.

Sometimes a phrase is slightly off but in key. In this case sliding up or down won't help, but you'd be amazed how how even repeating the same wrong riff will make it sound intentionally funky. Otherwise repeat the same phrase but change the off note and it'll sound all thematic.

My tricks for scraping by. Probably not more than a cent and a half's worth.

inquiringfiddler - Posted - 02/18/2013:  14:33:13

I'd like to offer a few ideas on how to approach practicing improvisation. Hope they are useful

• Always use a back up track when experimenting with ideas. What you may think of as musically pointless and uninteresting can be turned into a great musical idea when played against the harmony. Band in a Box and youtube are great resources.

• Start familiarizing yourself with harmony. There is definitely no harm in having that knowledge. What is usually annoying is the way these concepts are taught. Music theory is your friend.

• Simplify things! We need to have in mind that there are basically 3 big families of chords: Major, minor and dominant chords. Even if they have weird extensions and names, all chords fall -or we can make them fall- into one of these categories. Chords are like chameleons. They change their color to blend in with their environment. This helps in organizing our material and immediately contextualizes our playing. By organizing our choices in this manner we soon realize that these three pockets of information are interrelated. When we realize that we start thinking like this: Hey! This looks like that thing I was using there, so I can probably substitute one for the other. This is where real fun starts. That is the basic mental process of demystifying music harmony and using it creatively. It is based on the fact that people tend to learn faster through thinking in relationships.

• Simplify things further! When we are called upon to improvise on a chord progression we are dealing with all sort of different chords passing by. Especially in faster tempos it seems impossible to recall our knowledge on what to play on each chord. The answer is that we should learn how to deal with groups of chords, instead of worrying about each chord separately. This is what experienced improvisers do, based on the fact that chord progressions are not random but very often built on certain ‘syntax’ rules. Knowledge of that syntax helps the improviser feel more comfortable in a given harmonic environment. Whether we should outline each chord or not is a matter of musical judgment and taste.

• Even further! Use a few notes when improvising, fewer than you think are necessary! Realize the musical importance of pauses. I personally tend to like players who create beautiful ideas with a minimal amount of material. You can find this soloing mentality in the playing of Gypsy guitarist Django Reinhardt and mandolinist David Grisman. Trying to be meaningful by playing a few notes will help you zoom into your playing and eventually encourage you to experiment with all the different ways you can treat a single note. This process not only will mature your interpretation, but it will also help you start thinking more while playing by providing a sense of breathing and relaxation.

• Be as rhythmical as you can. It is not only the rhythm section’s responsibility to provide a good sense of rhythm. Soloists are also responsible for the overall sense of rhythm the band generates. A few randomly selected notes that are well organized in time usually yield a more satisfying musical result than a bunch of harmonically interesting notes that have no groove.

• Use a wide range of dynamics. Define different levels of dynamics and keep passing from one to the other. This will make your playing more surprising and engaging. However, avoid overplaying your instrument, something that usually happens when we are overeager to play things we like a lot or feel comfortable with. We must separate between playing loud and sounding rough and clumsy.

• In the process of creating your own original ideas or when working up a solo, use your voice to assist you. Generate your idea by singing it first, and then play it on your instrument. All people have listened to a lot more music than they’ve actually played, so there is a lot of valuable information recorded in our heads. You call upon that hidden information through singing.

• Keep visual contact with your fellow musicians. Don’t immerse yourself into your own playing. Watching the people you play music with (sounds so obvious!) helps in the tightening up of the group. For example, if you are playing rhythm together with someone else, watch each other’s hand or nod your heads to the rhythm and use that visual information to make your music groove. This habit will eventually lead to more interaction between musicians, musical energy, and of course enjoyment for you and those who are watching and listening.

• If you think about it, when playing in a band most of the time we are not actually soloing. But why sit down all that time doing nothing? Assist the band in playing rhythm. Don’t exclude yourself from what’s going on because you are not soloing. If you do, make it seem and sound as a musical choice, not because ‘you can’t play rhythm on the violin’. Bluegrass fiddlers have developed very interesting techniques playing rhythm. Try to figure out what they are doing and again, start stealing.

• When you play over a certain chord you can try to avoid thinking in terms of the root of that chord. For example, when you have a chord with D as the root (Dmaj7, Dm6, D7, etc), use ideas built on a different root instead, like a scale that starts on A, or an arpeggio that starts on B. This approach makes our playing a lot more interesting, and enhances our creativity and understanding. This is because when we play ‘root ideas’ we more or less provide sounds that are usually well defined by our rhythm section anyway. When we play with a different root in mind as a reference, we immediately contribute a different sound framework making the final result more complete and satisfying.

• One final point: what makes something sound ‘inside’ or ‘outside’, ‘correct’ or ‘wrong, is a complex matter. It depends on the style of music, the evolvement of a musical style, the use of rhythmic patterns, the individual sound of each instrument, expression, personal taste and so on. In practice, there are actually no wrong notes but only wrong resolutions. We can generalize this idea by saying that good improvisers can handle a ‘mistake’, in the direction of contextualizing it and turning it into something meaningful and musical. In my experience one key concept is intention. Whenever the human ear detects intention behind sounds, these sounds are more likely to be perceived as correct or valid. Put in other words, we should also focus on interpretation. This does not mean that we can play anything we want as long as it is played with conviction and taste or… maybe it does if you like, but only after we have proved that we are actually able to carry out our typical musical duties satisfactorily.

Stergios

Joel Glassman - Posted - 04/04/2013:  17:23:15

I use something called "guide-tone lines" when improvising.
Write down a series of chords [ie. just the letters: e7 a7 d7 g7 c7] on staff paper.
One bar for each chord. Below each chord notate the third [for G the third is B etc]
Learn to play the B against a strummed G chord and then play the E against the C chord.
I hum this sound of changing "mini-drones" in my head when playing Jazz.
It anchors you to the chords, because the third is such a strong and important sound.
I then play improvisations using evolving mutations of melody moving along these lines,
emphasizing the 3rd. To make it more interesting, include other chord tones, 7th root and
5th. Try to make the transitions subtle ie the smallest possible interval leap between
the chord tones of 2 chords. These drone sounds become second nature quickly after
practicing them a bit. Ear training will do it... Also in listening to bass players.

muzioabelardo - Posted - 03/13/2014:  05:58:24

quote:

---

Originally posted by fdllicks

 

The skill an advanced player has is to recover from mistakes. Recovering from mistakes without losing the timing is a priceless skill, and what seperates intermediates from advanced players more than playing 'perfectly'.

---

Jascha Heifetz was known to possess this skill. So good was he at recovering from mistakes that people barely noticed intonation twitches and was praised for always pulling perfect performances. Well he was only dubbed as one of the greatest classical violinists of the 20th century. Go figure. (I know this thread this more about improvisation but I just felt I needed to put it out there to emphasize how important this skill is in technique in general.)

bowdragger - Posted - 08/31/2014:  18:04:12

quote:

---

Originally posted by inquiringfiddler

 

I'd like to offer a few ideas on how to approach practicing improvisation. Hope they are useful



• Always use a back up track when experimenting with ideas. What you may think of as musically pointless and uninteresting can be turned into a great musical idea when played against the harmony. Band in a Box and youtube are great resources.



• Start familiarizing yourself with harmony. There is definitely no harm in having that knowledge. What is usually annoying is the way these concepts are taught. Music theory is your friend.



• Simplify things! We need to have in mind that there are basically 3 big families of chords: Major, minor and dominant chords. Even if they have weird extensions and names, all chords fall -or we can make them fall- into one of these categories. Chords are like chameleons. They change their color to blend in with their environment. This helps in organizing our material and immediately contextualizes our playing. By organizing our choices in this manner we soon realize that these three pockets of information are interrelated. When we realize that we start thinking like this: Hey! This looks like that thing I was using there, so I can probably substitute one for the other. This is where real fun starts. That is the basic mental process of demystifying music harmony and using it creatively. It is based on the fact that people tend to learn faster through thinking in relationships.



• Simplify things further! When we are called upon to improvise on a chord progression we are dealing with all sort of different chords passing by. Especially in faster tempos it seems impossible to recall our knowledge on what to play on each chord. The answer is that we should learn how to deal with groups of chords, instead of worrying about each chord separately. This is what experienced improvisers do, based on the fact that chord progressions are not random but very often built on certain ‘syntax’ rules. Knowledge of that syntax helps the improviser feel more comfortable in a given harmonic environment. Whether we should outline each chord or not is a matter of musical judgment and taste.



• Even further! Use a few notes when improvising, fewer than you think are necessary! Realize the musical importance of pauses. I personally tend to like players who create beautiful ideas with a minimal amount of material. You can find this soloing mentality in the playing of Gypsy guitarist Django Reinhardt and mandolinist David Grisman. Trying to be meaningful by playing a few notes will help you zoom into your playing and eventually encourage you to experiment with all the different ways you can treat a single note. This process not only will mature your interpretation, but it will also help you start thinking more while playing by providing a sense of breathing and relaxation.



• Be as rhythmical as you can. It is not only the rhythm section’s responsibility to provide a good sense of rhythm. Soloists are also responsible for the overall sense of rhythm the band generates. A few randomly selected notes that are well organized in time usually yield a more satisfying musical result than a bunch of harmonically interesting notes that have no groove.



• Use a wide range of dynamics. Define different levels of dynamics and keep passing from one to the other. This will make your playing more surprising and engaging. However, avoid overplaying your instrument, something that usually happens when we are overeager to play things we like a lot or feel comfortable with. We must separate between playing loud and sounding rough and clumsy.



• In the process of creating your own original ideas or when working up a solo, use your voice to assist you. Generate your idea by singing it first, and then play it on your instrument. All people have listened to a lot more music than they’ve actually played, so there is a lot of valuable information recorded in our heads. You call upon that hidden information through singing.



• Keep visual contact with your fellow musicians. Don’t immerse yourself into your own playing. Watching the people you play music with (sounds so obvious!) helps in the tightening up of the group. For example, if you are playing rhythm together with someone else, watch each other’s hand or nod your heads to the rhythm and use that visual information to make your music groove. This habit will eventually lead to more interaction between musicians, musical energy, and of course enjoyment for you and those who are watching and listening.



• If you think about it, when playing in a band most of the time we are not actually soloing. But why sit down all that time doing nothing? Assist the band in playing rhythm. Don’t exclude yourself from what’s going on because you are not soloing. If you do, make it seem and sound as a musical choice, not because ‘you can’t play rhythm on the violin’. Bluegrass fiddlers have developed very interesting techniques playing rhythm. Try to figure out what they are doing and again, start stealing.



• When you play over a certain chord you can try to avoid thinking in terms of the root of that chord. For example, when you have a chord with D as the root (Dmaj7, Dm6, D7, etc), use ideas built on a different root instead, like a scale that starts on A, or an arpeggio that starts on B. This approach makes our playing a lot more interesting, and enhances our creativity and understanding. This is because when we play ‘root ideas’ we more or less provide sounds that are usually well defined by our rhythm section anyway. When we play with a different root in mind as a reference, we immediately contribute a different sound framework making the final result more complete and satisfying.



• One final point: what makes something sound ‘inside’ or ‘outside’, ‘correct’ or ‘wrong, is a complex matter. It depends on the style of music, the evolvement of a musical style, the use of rhythmic patterns, the individual sound of each instrument, expression, personal taste and so on. In practice, there are actually no wrong notes but only wrong resolutions. We can generalize this idea by saying that good improvisers can handle a ‘mistake’, in the direction of contextualizing it and turning it into something meaningful and musical. In my experience one key concept is intention. Whenever the human ear detects intention behind sounds, these sounds are more likely to be perceived as correct or valid. Put in other words, we should also focus on interpretation. This does not mean that we can play anything we want as long as it is played with conviction and taste or… maybe it does if you like, but only after we have proved that we are actually able to carry out our typical musical duties satisfactorily.



Stergios

 

---

This is the best post I've seen in a long time. I'm putting these ideas to work right away in Limehouse Blues. Thanks!

irfiddler - Posted - 08/31/2014:  18:47:02

quote:

---

Originally posted by inquiringfiddler

• In the process of creating your own original ideas or when working up a solo, use your voice to assist you. Generate your idea by singing it first, and then play it on your instrument. All people have listened to a lot more music than they’ve actually played, so there is a lot of valuable information recorded in our heads. You call upon that hidden information through singing.

Stergios

 

---

This seems to be the stage I'm at right now. For a while  I've been  immersing myself in as many  different recordings of a few favorite swing standards as I can find.   I only pick tunes I really love and can happily listen to over and over. It wouldn't work for me otherwise. 

I let it all marinate for a while - sometimes quite a while - and suddenly - out of the blue - here I am whistling and singing my own versions of these tunes. I freely admit I've borrowed a lick here or there and added them into my own idea of how this tune should sound.  Currently it's Lady Be Good.. I can get so into the tune that I become almost unaware of my surroundings.  So...I have to be careful not to do this when I'm operating heavy machinery of any kind! 

The next step is to transfer the tune I hear to my fingers - and do some refining and polishing. I know this will not be the final answer for each tune.  They will keep evolving as long as I play them.  It is a very exciting place to be musically.

I need to look closely at Diane in Chicago's backup track post.  That looks very impressive. 

So glad this thread has appeared again!  I had forgotten about it.  

Edited by - irfiddler on 08/31/2014 18:51:49

fujers - Posted - 09/01/2014:  09:02:56

We all have read the above article right. What the writer didn't say was. It's going to take time

Like a fine wine it has to age before it's ready. In other words you're going to have study your instrument to get anything out of it

You're going to have study your instrument..know how scales work..learn phrasing...learn all there is to be good at improv.

You have to use your imagination and skills, skills that come with time. This will take most of you years to learn. But don't be afraid of improv use it everytime you get the chance thats what makes fiddling.. fiddling.

Most of you think that you can't improv. Thats not true. I don't care where you are in your fiddling. Just make something up anything it doesn't matter. Improv

If you don't try it won't happen. Explore your fiddle and your fiddle will reward you. Jerry

fujers - Posted - 09/01/2014:  10:08:39

bowdragger, Very good post. It's the same same I've saying all along very good. However you use the term inside and outside. I think of this this way. When I play on the inside. I'm playing around the melody...when I play on the out side I play abstract scales. I know what you mean tho. Nice post brother

Skookum - Posted - 09/02/2014:  21:44:54

Joel Glassman wrote: "I use something called "guide-tone lines" when improvising.
Write down a series of chords [ie. just the letters: e7 a7 d7 g7 c7] on staff paper.
One bar for each chord. Below each chord notate the third [for G the third is B etc]
Learn to play the B against a strummed G chord and then play the E against the C chord.
I hum this sound of changing "mini-drones" in my head when playing Jazz.
It anchors you to the chords, because the third is such a strong and important sound.
I then play improvisations using evolving mutations of melody moving along these lines,
emphasizing the 3rd. To make it more interesting, include other chord tones, 7th root and
5th. Try to make the transitions subtle ie the smallest possible interval leap between
the chord tones of 2 chords. These drone sounds become second nature quickly after
practicing them a bit. Ear training will do it... Also in listening to bass players."

This is the sort of help I can sink my teeth into and start using right away. Same with the thread a while back about playing portions of pentatonic scales over chords - again, something I found very helpful. Are there other helpful hints?

wrench13 - Posted - 11/03/2014:  08:46:47

No such thing as a wrong note - all ya gotta do is SELL it like its the right one. And then get back to the right ones.
:-)

mmuussiiccaall - Posted - 11/04/2014:  05:00:23

The fabulous James Brown soul singer was known to dance with his back to the audience sliding across the stage as if he were conducting his band. The audience thought this was part of the act and few realized what was going on.

The hand signals he flashed to his band with a splayed hand were not a high-five. He was signing "5 dollars" to a particular member of the band. 5 dollars was his fine for his musicians when he heard a wrong note or noticed un-shined shoes. Each pulse of Brown’s hand was a five dollar fine; five pulses would mean a fine of twenty-five dollars!

If you look carefully, I'm sure you can see the musicians faces drop as they receive the signals.

fujers - Posted - 11/19/2014:  14:50:07

Well to me. James Brown was a butt head. There's not anyone who doesn't make mistakes weather you can hear them or not is up to your ears.

Tell me was James a great musician. I venture to say no. I never heard him play anything. But I never heard a lot of stuff

fiddlinsteudel - Posted - 11/19/2014:  16:39:29

Is someone who just sings/writes songs not a musician? I think so. But for the record he did play the keys.

fiddlechops - Posted - 11/19/2014:  22:14:59

quote:

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Originally posted by mmuussiiccaall

 

5 dollars was his fine for his musicians when he heard a wrong note or noticed un-shined shoes.

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Yeah, I  am having difficulty in believing this.....With the caliber of musician Brown could afford, I doubt any of them could play a wrong note....''un-shined shoes'' oh yeah, maybe....

fiddlinsteudel - Posted - 11/19/2014:  22:42:15

It's very well documented that James Brown fined his musicians for both miscues or messed up clothes. Just do some searching on the internet you'll find interviews, book excerpts, etc.

Edited by - fiddlinsteudel on 11/19/2014 22:44:14

fiddlechops - Posted - 11/20/2014:  00:14:25

quote:

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Originally posted by fiddlinsteudel

 

It's very well documented that James Brown fined his musicians for both miscues or messed up clothes. Just do some searching on the internet you'll find interviews, book excerpts, etc.

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Ok, thanks.....now I believe it..............

fiddlinsteudel - Posted - 11/20/2014:  09:47:38

quote:

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Originally posted by fiddlebutcher

 

quote:

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Ok, thanks.....now I believe it..............

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I sense some sarcasm. :)

JHDuncan - Posted - 11/20/2014:  13:34:16

fiddlinsteudel - Posted - 11/20/2014:  13:36:33

quote:

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Originally posted by JHDuncan

 

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Wow he's probably high as a kite ...